I feel like Fox's Uair is really good in this game especially for killing if you keep if fresh. Also the fact that he can upB after his sideB seems to have given him a really good horizontal recovery.
10/13/2014 05:34:19
Discuss the Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS character Fox character discussion in this thread.
Pros:
• Good horizontal recovery; Side B no longer puts Fox in a free fall state
• Decent combo potential (juggle your opponent)
• Great Aerial game
• Good movement speed
Cons:
• Lightweight
• Does not have a spike (but he does have a "pseudo spike", see Fair Spike section)
Pro and Con?
• Fox fast fall speed allows him to reach the ground quicker to continue juggling your opponent but at the same time causes Fox to be easily juggled himself.
Moveset
Jab1: 2%
Jab2: 1%
Jab3: 1% each tick, 2% on final hit (5% total for minimum duration)
Full jab combo 2 + 1 + 5 = 8 at minimum duration. See section on Jab Cancel for more information.
Ftilt: 6%, 8% (angled up), 7% (angled down)
A single kick. Nothing special and will probably rarely be used.
Dtilt: 8%, 7% (near tip), 6% (tip)
Fox does a sweep with his tail. Equally as underwhelming as Ftilt and will probably rarely be used. The tip of the tail will send the opponent upwards vertically, allowing for aerial followups. Can be used when window for Utilt (tipped) to Uair has been missed due to lower knock back on Dtilt (tipped).
Utilt: 9% (directly behind Fox), 7% (behind Fox's head / near tip), 6% (above Fox's head / tip)
Fox's best tilt in terms of combos. Fox can string together Utilts at low % to rack up easy damage. Once the opponent is ~40% (or whenever they start to get knocked back too far), jump after them and hit them with any aerial. It is possible to string Utilt (using tip hitbox because less knock back and sends them vertically up) into double jump Uair for a kill if they are ~ 110%. It is around this % where Utilt doesn't knock back too far and Uair is within kill %.
Nair: 9% initial hitbox, 6% subsequent hitboxes.
A sex kick, it comes out hard and grows softer over time. This aerial has low landing lag and will be used a fair bit. It can be used to approach and juggle your opponents (Nair then fast fall Utilt).
Fair: 7-8% (2% on first kick, 0-1% on the middle 3 kicks,4% on last kick)
Fox kicks 5 times in succession. This move has noticeable landing lag so be careful when using it. It can be used to spike your enemies, see Fair Spike section for more information.
Dair: 11-12%
Fox does a drill kick. Possibly Fox's worst aerial. Has noticeable landing lag and the last hit will always knock anyway your opponent before you can do anything else. Only use when you predict a jump from your opponent i.e. you full hop pre-emptively and greet them with your foot.
Uair: 16%, consist of a weak 5% kick followed by a strong 11% kick
Easily Fox best aerial in terms of kill potential. Kills mid air opponents at 110%+.
Bair: 13%
Fox kicks behind him. A decent aerial and has little landing lag. It has a tiny bit of start up lag. Can be used to gimp your opponent if their recovery sucks.
Fsmash: 14% - 19% (fully charged)
Fox leaps forward and lands a single kick. This is Fox's slowest Smash attack. Use to punish rolls.
Dsmash: 14% - 19% (fully charged)
Fox does a split and attacks in front and behind him simultaneously. Use to punish rolls.
Usmash: 16% - 22% (fully charged), sour spot behind Fox's head11% - 15% (fully charged)
Fox does a flip kick. Fox's best smash attack. It can kill when the opponent is 120%+ on average (depends on character weight) .
Neutral B: 1% furthest range, 2% mid-range, 3% each tick at point blank range
Pew pew pew, Fox fires lasers in quick succession. Has substantial ending lag so don't use it too close to the enemy unless you want to get hit before you can even put your gun away.
Side B: 3%
Fox illusion. A great utility skill that has good horizontal recovery and can be used offensively (provided you don't spam it and become predictable). Although this move is weaker than Falco's and does not spike, it sets up Uair kills very nicely when your opponent vectors the wrong way. Note that ground side B has huge ending lag so always jump cancel and use it (that way you get the landing lag instead which is much shorter).
Up B: 2% from charging flames each tick up to 7 ticks, 14% on initial hitbox and 8% on subsequent hitboxes (can do a total of 28% if your opponent gets stuck in it from start to finish).
Fox's vertical recovery move. Fox charges for a short time before bursting into flames in the direction you are holding. Fox is most vulnerable during charging and can easily be gimped.
Down B: 2%
The shine used to be great but over time it lost functionality. It lost the ability to be cancelled* then it further lost its ability to spike. Only useful for reflecting projectiles or shine stalling in the air. *You can cancel the shine during reflection animation though.
Changes from Brawl
• Fair is weaker and no longer pushes Fox up into the air (Foxcopter). However the mechanics of some multi hit moves have been changed that makes it easier to connect multi hits (See section on Fair spike for more information).
• Aerials all have landing lag, some longer than others.
• Short Hop Double Laser no longer auto-cancels on landing (applicable to Falco too)
• Side B can no longer be cancelled (applicable to Falco too)
• Fox runs slightly slower than in Brawl.
Fox Techniques
Jab Cancel
Jab1 > Jab2 > pause a bit > any move you want.
Jab Jab Grab and Jab Jab turnaround Utilt are some solid choices.
It is easier to jab cancel floaty characters, e.g. Rosalina and Peach, as the jabs pick them up the ground long enough before they can counter attack. For characters that fall quickly, e.g. Shiek and Captain Falcon, you will need to jab cancel at much higher % (like 100%+ to be reliable) otherwise you will easier get shield grabbed.
Fair Spike
Multi hit moves in this game appear to apply a vector on the opponent equal to the direction Fox is moving. This creates the "sticky" effect of having all hits in a multi hit move connect. Hence it is also possible to "spike" your opponent when Fox is moving downwards. The spiking effect is amplified when Fox fast falls (and given his already fast fall rate by default), it can kill most opponents when they are sent over the edge.
When spiking onto the stage, be mindful that your opponent can tech the spike while Fox is still stuck in Fair landing animation. Your opponent can easily punish you with a smash of their own. If they fail the tech, feel free to Utilt them back up into another Fair.
Shine Cancel
During the reflection animation, Fox can cancel the shine into a jump. Not particularly useful for anything unless your opponent tries to grab you at that instant which you can then leap and Nair their face.
DoT 11/27/2014 10:43:15
Your Fox and You.
Pros:
• Good horizontal recovery; Side B no longer puts Fox in a free fall state
• Decent combo potential (juggle your opponent)
• Great Aerial game
• Good movement speed
Cons:
• Lightweight
• Does not have a spike (but he does have a "pseudo spike", see Fair Spike section)
Pro and Con?
• Fox fast fall speed allows him to reach the ground quicker to continue juggling your opponent but at the same time causes Fox to be easily juggled himself.
Moveset
Jab1: 2%
Jab2: 1%
Jab3: 1% each tick, 2% on final hit (5% total for minimum duration)
Full jab combo 2 + 1 + 5 = 8 at minimum duration. See section on Jab Cancel for more information.
Ftilt: 6%, 8% (angled up), 7% (angled down)
A single kick. Nothing special and will probably rarely be used.
Dtilt: 8%, 7% (near tip), 6% (tip)
Fox does a sweep with his tail. Equally as underwhelming as Ftilt and will probably rarely be used. The tip of the tail will send the opponent upwards vertically, allowing for aerial followups. Can be used when window for Utilt (tipped) to Uair has been missed due to lower knock back on Dtilt (tipped).
Utilt: 9% (directly behind Fox), 7% (behind Fox's head / near tip), 6% (above Fox's head / tip)
Fox's best tilt in terms of combos. Fox can string together Utilts at low % to rack up easy damage. Once the opponent is ~40% (or whenever they start to get knocked back too far), jump after them and hit them with any aerial. It is possible to string Utilt (using tip hitbox because less knock back and sends them vertically up) into double jump Uair for a kill if they are ~ 110%. It is around this % where Utilt doesn't knock back too far and Uair is within kill %.
Nair: 9% initial hitbox, 6% subsequent hitboxes.
A sex kick, it comes out hard and grows softer over time. This aerial has low landing lag and will be used a fair bit. It can be used to approach and juggle your opponents (Nair then fast fall Utilt).
Fair: 7-8% (2% on first kick, 0-1% on the middle 3 kicks,4% on last kick)
Fox kicks 5 times in succession. This move has noticeable landing lag so be careful when using it. It can be used to spike your enemies, see Fair Spike section for more information.
Dair: 11-12%
Fox does a drill kick. Possibly Fox's worst aerial. Has noticeable landing lag and the last hit will always knock anyway your opponent before you can do anything else. Only use when you predict a jump from your opponent i.e. you full hop pre-emptively and greet them with your foot.
Uair: 16%, consist of a weak 5% kick followed by a strong 11% kick
Easily Fox best aerial in terms of kill potential. Kills mid air opponents at 110%+.
Bair: 13%
Fox kicks behind him. A decent aerial and has little landing lag. It has a tiny bit of start up lag. Can be used to gimp your opponent if their recovery sucks.
Fsmash: 14% - 19% (fully charged)
Fox leaps forward and lands a single kick. This is Fox's slowest Smash attack. Use to punish rolls.
Dsmash: 14% - 19% (fully charged)
Fox does a split and attacks in front and behind him simultaneously. Use to punish rolls.
Usmash: 16% - 22% (fully charged), sour spot behind Fox's head11% - 15% (fully charged)
Fox does a flip kick. Fox's best smash attack. It can kill when the opponent is 120%+ on average (depends on character weight) .
Neutral B: 1% furthest range, 2% mid-range, 3% each tick at point blank range
Pew pew pew, Fox fires lasers in quick succession. Has substantial ending lag so don't use it too close to the enemy unless you want to get hit before you can even put your gun away.
Side B: 3%
Fox illusion. A great utility skill that has good horizontal recovery and can be used offensively (provided you don't spam it and become predictable). Although this move is weaker than Falco's and does not spike, it sets up Uair kills very nicely when your opponent vectors the wrong way. Note that ground side B has huge ending lag so always jump cancel and use it (that way you get the landing lag instead which is much shorter).
Up B: 2% from charging flames each tick up to 7 ticks, 14% on initial hitbox and 8% on subsequent hitboxes (can do a total of 28% if your opponent gets stuck in it from start to finish).
Fox's vertical recovery move. Fox charges for a short time before bursting into flames in the direction you are holding. Fox is most vulnerable during charging and can easily be gimped.
Down B: 2%
The shine used to be great but over time it lost functionality. It lost the ability to be cancelled* then it further lost its ability to spike. Only useful for reflecting projectiles or shine stalling in the air. *You can cancel the shine during reflection animation though.
Changes from Brawl
• Fair is weaker and no longer pushes Fox up into the air (Foxcopter). However the mechanics of some multi hit moves have been changed that makes it easier to connect multi hits (See section on Fair spike for more information).
• Aerials all have landing lag, some longer than others.
• Short Hop Double Laser no longer auto-cancels on landing (applicable to Falco too)
• Side B can no longer be cancelled (applicable to Falco too)
• Fox runs slightly slower than in Brawl.
Fox Techniques
Jab Cancel
Jab1 > Jab2 > pause a bit > any move you want.
Jab Jab Grab and Jab Jab turnaround Utilt are some solid choices.
It is easier to jab cancel floaty characters, e.g. Rosalina and Peach, as the jabs pick them up the ground long enough before they can counter attack. For characters that fall quickly, e.g. Shiek and Captain Falcon, you will need to jab cancel at much higher % (like 100%+ to be reliable) otherwise you will easier get shield grabbed.
Fair Spike
Multi hit moves in this game appear to apply a vector on the opponent equal to the direction Fox is moving. This creates the "sticky" effect of having all hits in a multi hit move connect. Hence it is also possible to "spike" your opponent when Fox is moving downwards. The spiking effect is amplified when Fox fast falls (and given his already fast fall rate by default), it can kill most opponents when they are sent over the edge.
When spiking onto the stage, be mindful that your opponent can tech the spike while Fox is still stuck in Fair landing animation. Your opponent can easily punish you with a smash of their own. If they fail the tech, feel free to Utilt them back up into another Fair.
Shine Cancel
During the reflection animation, Fox can cancel the shine into a jump. Not particularly useful for anything unless your opponent tries to grab you at that instant which you can then leap and Nair their face.
DoT 11/27/2014 10:43:15
- His Uair seems equally as lethal in this game compared to brawl.
- True that SideB no longer puts you in a freefall state but it seems like it cannot be cancelled anymore (same with Falco).
- Fair is better this game as it seems to "suck in" the opponent between the kicks i.e. it's easier to land and deal damage.
- Dair has landing lag and now knocks back the opponent at the end of it. Cannot use Dair into Utilts because of this.
- Like Falco, SHDL isn't a thing anymore.
- SH and immediately side B is still a thing though. Less lag at the end of it because you enter falling animation instead of side B animation. But since you can't cancel sideB anymore it might send you over the ledge. Normal side B on ground will take you up to as far as the ledge without going over.
- Shine feels like it got nerfed, longer delay and less knock back. If you are gonna try and shine spike, you are better off going for a Uair or Bair when chasing them off the ledge.
- Fox can do a jab cancel kind of thing, AA pause AA pause etc. AA to SH Dair or Utilt are some of my favourite ones. A combo at ~40-50% would be AA, turn around Utilt, SH Fair (full jump Fair if ~60-70%).
- Nair/dash attacks at low % can set up a series of Utilts. Same thing at 50%+ hop and go for the Fair or another Nair.
- If Fox can manage a Dthrow at low % and the opponent doesnt DI (or vectoring in this game) too far away. Fox can follow up with Fair (unless he air dodge or something, in which case you anticipate it, fast fall with him and punish him on landing). It may also be possible to follow up with another Uair after that but that really depends on the % and weight of the character you are against.
Overall, feels the same like in Brawl. I only feel that he is better than Falco now is because Falco got hit hard in the face with a nerf hammer.
10/18/2014 05:02:54
- True that SideB no longer puts you in a freefall state but it seems like it cannot be cancelled anymore (same with Falco).
- Fair is better this game as it seems to "suck in" the opponent between the kicks i.e. it's easier to land and deal damage.
- Dair has landing lag and now knocks back the opponent at the end of it. Cannot use Dair into Utilts because of this.
- Like Falco, SHDL isn't a thing anymore.
- SH and immediately side B is still a thing though. Less lag at the end of it because you enter falling animation instead of side B animation. But since you can't cancel sideB anymore it might send you over the ledge. Normal side B on ground will take you up to as far as the ledge without going over.
- Shine feels like it got nerfed, longer delay and less knock back. If you are gonna try and shine spike, you are better off going for a Uair or Bair when chasing them off the ledge.
- Fox can do a jab cancel kind of thing, AA pause AA pause etc. AA to SH Dair or Utilt are some of my favourite ones. A combo at ~40-50% would be AA, turn around Utilt, SH Fair (full jump Fair if ~60-70%).
- Nair/dash attacks at low % can set up a series of Utilts. Same thing at 50%+ hop and go for the Fair or another Nair.
- If Fox can manage a Dthrow at low % and the opponent doesnt DI (or vectoring in this game) too far away. Fox can follow up with Fair (unless he air dodge or something, in which case you anticipate it, fast fall with him and punish him on landing). It may also be possible to follow up with another Uair after that but that really depends on the % and weight of the character you are against.
Overall, feels the same like in Brawl. I only feel that he is better than Falco now is because Falco got hit hard in the face with a nerf hammer.
10/18/2014 05:02:54
Would DoT like to claim the Fox thread?
10/18/2014 06:16:48
10/18/2014 06:16:48
Demonstration on Fox's Jab Cancel to Utilt.
10/28/2014 11:04:20
Wii U: newbie.one42
DoT said:
- His Uair seems equally as lethal in this game compared to brawl.
- True that SideB no longer puts you in a freefall state but it seems like it cannot be cancelled anymore (same with Falco).
- Fair is better this game as it seems to "suck in" the opponent between the kicks i.e. it's easier to land and deal damage.
- Dair has landing lag and now knocks back the opponent at the end of it. Cannot use Dair into Utilts because of this.
- Like Falco, SHDL isn't a thing anymore.
- SH and immediately side B is still a thing though. Less lag at the end of it because you enter falling animation instead of side B animation. But since you can't cancel sideB anymore it might send you over the ledge. Normal side B on ground will take you up to as far as the ledge without going over.
- Shine feels like it got nerfed, longer delay and less knock back. If you are gonna try and shine spike, you are better off going for a Uair or Bair when chasing them off the ledge.
- Fox can do a jab cancel kind of thing, AA pause AA pause etc. AA to SH Dair or Utilt are some of my favourite ones. A combo at ~40-50% would be AA, turn around Utilt, SH Fair (full jump Fair if ~60-70%).
- Nair/dash attacks at low % can set up a series of Utilts. Same thing at 50%+ hop and go for the Fair or another Nair.
- If Fox can manage a Dthrow at low % and the opponent doesnt DI (or vectoring in this game) too far away. Fox can follow up with Fair (unless he air dodge or something, in which case you anticipate it, fast fall with him and punish him on landing). It may also be possible to follow up with another Uair after that but that really depends on the % and weight of the character you are against.
Overall, feels the same like in Brawl. I only feel that he is better than Falco now is because Falco got hit hard in the face with a nerf hammer.
That was some nice info on fox. Wouldn't mind some on the other characters if you have any insight on them too.
10/28/2014 10:41:37
Sorry, only been playing Fox since release. I did briefly started with Falco but he feels so different that I just switched over to Fox. I really should pick up another character X_x.
Anyways Greninja hydro pump is lol worthy. Check this out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7SzDYhf18c&feature=player_detailpage&list=PLTfl9Ul3etope0JqtuNX3fN0JRKhxfec1#t=965
10/28/2014 10:44:56
Anyways Greninja hydro pump is lol worthy. Check this out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7SzDYhf18c&feature=player_detailpage&list=PLTfl9Ul3etope0JqtuNX3fN0JRKhxfec1#t=965
10/28/2014 10:44:56
Do Rosalinas so I don't have to do it >.<
Falco does seem really weird in this game
10/28/2014 10:48:48
Falco does seem really weird in this game
10/28/2014 10:48:48
10/28/2014 10:50:54
Wii U: newbie.one42
Yeah, the moment I saw someone try to do shdl with falco. Dat lag. T_T
10/28/2014 10:51:14
10/28/2014 10:51:14
DoT I worked it out (youtube)10numbers/letters(/youtube)
Also there should a YouTube icon just above the text box you can input it in there also
Replace ( ) with [ ]
10/28/2014 10:57:50
Also there should a YouTube icon just above the text box you can input it in there also
Replace ( ) with [ ]
10/28/2014 10:57:50
DoT is now the owner of this thread.
He did not ask for it nor does he get a say in the matter.
10/28/2014 11:26:03
He did not ask for it nor does he get a say in the matter.
10/28/2014 11:26:03
ADMIN said:
DoT is now the owner of this thread.
He did not ask for it nor does he get a say in the matter.
Aw ok, I will accept this responsibility and do whatever it is that thread owners do.
Also Fox Fair spike, lol at the start when Fairs collide.
10/28/2014 11:46:35
How does this spike work?
10/28/2014 11:51:06
10/28/2014 11:51:06
I think I wrote it in the youtube description but basically Fox's Fair consist of 5 kicks. I'm not sure if kicks 2,3 and 4 all spikes but its definitely one of the middle ones. You just SH -> Fair -> Fast fall and it should make your opponent eat dirt. I think Fast Falling also increases the momentum that it sends them down but don't quote me on that because I'm not sure, from the video it looks like CPU Fox went heaps far down, I mean he was only 13%.
I'm not sure how well it can be used as a suicide move when doing it off stage to take the opponent down with you i.e. does the Fair animation last long enough for you both to plummet together or will the Fair finish and send your opponent up on the 5th kick.
This probably old news by now but I will leave this here. Not really a shine cancel since it's only possible to cancel during the reflection animation.
More videos. The second one is possible with any character when tossing items.
More Fox stuff.
Dair is mediorce imo. Dair to Utilt only works at very low % and may not even work against light character at all. Dtilt hitbox at the tip sends opponent straight up which is useful for Uair strings. Not as far as Utilt but use when you miss the Utilt to Uair window (~110%), I guess.
11/27/2014 09:51:51
I'm not sure how well it can be used as a suicide move when doing it off stage to take the opponent down with you i.e. does the Fair animation last long enough for you both to plummet together or will the Fair finish and send your opponent up on the 5th kick.
This probably old news by now but I will leave this here. Not really a shine cancel since it's only possible to cancel during the reflection animation.
More videos. The second one is possible with any character when tossing items.
More Fox stuff.
Dair is mediorce imo. Dair to Utilt only works at very low % and may not even work against light character at all. Dtilt hitbox at the tip sends opponent straight up which is useful for Uair strings. Not as far as Utilt but use when you miss the Utilt to Uair window (~110%), I guess.
11/27/2014 09:51:51
3DS: 2406-5149-1677
some interesting stuff in the new video. the combos mostly feel easier said than done, particularly on the circle pad. there are no words for how badly I want to be able to dashdance.
11/27/2014 10:14:21
11/27/2014 10:14:21
I played on the wii U today and it was pretty fun to use the GC controller again =D. Abit hard to see what the heck was going on in a 8 player smash =S. Anyways speaking of combos, a reliable combo I find is if the opponent is near the ledge, you can double jab twice (not 3 times otherwise Fox will fall off and grab the ledge) which will then take them off the ledge, you can then turn around Utilt and not worry about getting shielded or anything. Then follow with a jump + Bair. Most of the time it won't kill but you might get lucky with some characters, depending on weight of course. Good video covering Fox's double jab.
02/05/2015 13:58:33
02/05/2015 13:58:33
A lot of old information in this thread about fox that is no-longer relevant.
Needs to be updated that fox is a cool guy and he doesn't afraid of anything
08/03/2015 03:34:23
Needs to be updated that fox is a cool guy and he doesn't afraid of anything
08/03/2015 03:34:23
Do you ever play online much hopedealer? One of my friends plays fox and i've always wanted to see how i'd do against you. But we never meet in bracket :c
08/03/2015 07:17:24
08/03/2015 07:17:24
The jab stuff has changed, most of the other information is the same.
If you are looking for anything specific/have any questions post them here.
08/05/2015 19:46:05
If you are looking for anything specific/have any questions post them here.
08/05/2015 19:46:05
One time after the patch i tilted a Link off the stage as Fox then i shined his upB and he was stage spiked and died now i love Fox again he will be one of my mains.
08/07/2015 08:51:43
08/07/2015 08:51:43