12/22/2016 08:42:44
12/22/2016 08:42:44
mr l lookig at his posts was actually acting pretty protown. possibly he was acting so pro town the serial killer wanted to get rid of him? I find it unlikley a town player wouldve used a night kill on him unless they had a super hard read. This confirms a serial killer though it was likely to have one before this pretty much confirms it.
12/22/2016 08:49:39
12/22/2016 08:49:39
HydroPimp said:
mr l lookig at his posts was actually acting pretty protown. possibly he was acting so pro town the serial killer wanted to get rid of him? I find it unlikley a town player wouldve used a night kill on him unless they had a super hard read. This confirms a serial killer though it was likely to have one before this pretty much confirms it.
This basically happened to me in the previous game, I acted pro-town and Aero went after me twice.
12/22/2016 08:53:42
can we prohibit lachlan from playing in future games? his idea of "having fun" is playing completely anti-town and having people waste a lynch on him, which is incredibly frustrating for anyone trying to play the game properly (though if his role was indeed useless and identifies everyone as non-vanilla then he was honestly the optimal non-mafia lynch rofl). thank god someone eliminated a maf for us at least. no townies dead is also really weird, unless there's a couple of protective roles and one of em got lucky. people are theorizing a lot but i'm gonna go with occam's razor and say that it's much more likely that there's a 3rd party that is also gonna be night killing us.
since we don't have any real leads to go off of based on who died at night, i'll bring something to people's attention that i noticed in day 1 and thought was really unnatural; back on page 15, bijou mentioned that he thought lachlan was potentially 'claiming arsonist' and posted a vote on him. within around an hour of this, multiple people made posts saying the same thing and also voting for lachlan, which is where the bandwagon really kicked off. a couple of them (cjeccjec and invisi) then unvoted extremely quickly. while bijou has been seemingly pretty pro-town (i do kinda get bad vibes from him though? feels like he's trying very hard to control the flow of the game. this is 100% hunch so don't take my word. anyone else have thoughts on this?) i think it's definitely worth looking at the others who bandwagoned extremely quickly.
also as a side note i feel like day 1 dragged out so long cause people would vote for someone then as soon as they said anything remotely pro-town they went "oh well guess i'm not suspicious anymore! UNVOTE" pls be more suspicious of people, the mafia is going to lie to you lmao how the heck does this post already have one like i posted like 20 seconds ago how do you read that fast
12/22/2016 09:45:15
since we don't have any real leads to go off of based on who died at night, i'll bring something to people's attention that i noticed in day 1 and thought was really unnatural; back on page 15, bijou mentioned that he thought lachlan was potentially 'claiming arsonist' and posted a vote on him. within around an hour of this, multiple people made posts saying the same thing and also voting for lachlan, which is where the bandwagon really kicked off. a couple of them (cjeccjec and invisi) then unvoted extremely quickly. while bijou has been seemingly pretty pro-town (i do kinda get bad vibes from him though? feels like he's trying very hard to control the flow of the game. this is 100% hunch so don't take my word. anyone else have thoughts on this?) i think it's definitely worth looking at the others who bandwagoned extremely quickly.
also as a side note i feel like day 1 dragged out so long cause people would vote for someone then as soon as they said anything remotely pro-town they went "oh well guess i'm not suspicious anymore! UNVOTE" pls be more suspicious of people, the mafia is going to lie to you lmao how the heck does this post already have one like i posted like 20 seconds ago how do you read that fast
12/22/2016 09:45:15
idk i just read the part that said to not let lachlan play anymore and insta liked. fuck him man what he does is just annoying he can fucken go to town of salem and fuck with people there for fun why he gotta do it here.
12/22/2016 09:49:13
12/22/2016 09:49:13
Extra said:
since we don't have any real leads to go off of based on who died at night, i'll bring something to people's attention that i noticed in day 1 and thought was really unnatural; back on page 15, bijou mentioned that he thought lachlan was potentially 'claiming arsonist' and posted a vote on him. within around an hour of this, multiple people made posts saying the same thing and also voting for lachlan, which is where the bandwagon really kicked off. a couple of them (cjeccjec and invisi) then unvoted extremely quickly. while bijou has been seemingly pretty pro-town (i do kinda get bad vibes from him though? feels like he's trying very hard to control the flow of the game. this is 100% hunch so don't take my word. anyone else have thoughts on this?) i think it's definitely worth looking at the others who bandwagoned extremely quickly.
I also noticed that people placed a lot of votes very quickly after I suggested he was likely to be an arsonist. You should all be critical of those players and, to a lesser degree, myself included since I essentially started the lynch train.
I don't understand why Lachlan was making references to Burn Up and such. Besides the fact he was a Growlithe, his role didn't have much of a connection to all the fire puns he was making.
Incidentally, the fact that he was a Vanilla Cop is great for the town. In Aero's last game Vanilla Cop was effectively a useless role because every player had a power role of some degree. I suspect this game is the same thing and for all intents and purposes Vanilla Cop in this game is as useful as a Vanilla Townie would be.
The mafia strongman dying night 1 is hella good in a game like this too. The fact that mafia had a two-hit strongman suggests there are some seriously good town power roles in play. Without a strongman to hit these roles they will have much more protection no doubt. I still stand by the fact that my reasoning that he was an arsonist was solid by the way. He's just a really special case.
12/22/2016 10:00:54
I do agree with Extra about the lynch train/bandwagon that was started by Bijou.
Bijou did make a reasonable argument about Lachlan hinting towards being an arsonist, but. Why would an arsonist out themselves? Especially on day 1? That makes no sense to me and is quite suicidal, but then again this is Lachlan we are talking about and the fact that he voted for himself is pretty weird and makes me question his skills as a player (which have been made apparent to be extremely poor by many people).
Also Bijou, "Losing a Vanilla Cop is great for Town".
I don't see how losing a town member is "great for town" in any way.
If you meant it as "It's better we lose this role than a more useful role." It is very poorly worded.
That comment feels suspicious to me and I will out you for it.
It may be so that Bijou is indeed a town member and is trying hard to get town to think logically, but I too have been getting bad vibes from the amount of pro-town posts he has made. I also don't think we should be suspicious of him "to a lesser degree" because he started the lynch train. I will also definitely take into consideration the reasoning behind the sudden avalanche of votes towards Lachlan.
I'm not satisfied with the reasoning behind:
JLo, Duon, Invisi, and Hydropimp.
I don't think "He is a troll, let's lynch him" is a good enough reason. (not saying that's the reason for all of you, just some of your justifications were weak.)
12/22/2016 10:36:52
Bijou did make a reasonable argument about Lachlan hinting towards being an arsonist, but. Why would an arsonist out themselves? Especially on day 1? That makes no sense to me and is quite suicidal, but then again this is Lachlan we are talking about and the fact that he voted for himself is pretty weird and makes me question his skills as a player (which have been made apparent to be extremely poor by many people).
Also Bijou, "Losing a Vanilla Cop is great for Town".
I don't see how losing a town member is "great for town" in any way.
If you meant it as "It's better we lose this role than a more useful role." It is very poorly worded.
That comment feels suspicious to me and I will out you for it.
It may be so that Bijou is indeed a town member and is trying hard to get town to think logically, but I too have been getting bad vibes from the amount of pro-town posts he has made. I also don't think we should be suspicious of him "to a lesser degree" because he started the lynch train. I will also definitely take into consideration the reasoning behind the sudden avalanche of votes towards Lachlan.
I'm not satisfied with the reasoning behind:
JLo, Duon, Invisi, and Hydropimp.
I don't think "He is a troll, let's lynch him" is a good enough reason. (not saying that's the reason for all of you, just some of your justifications were weak.)
12/22/2016 10:36:52
This is a game that I believe has insanely good town power roles. As such, losing just a Vanilla Cop is a very good result for town.
You can't hit mafia every time, so if we do mis-lynch then picking a player that constantly confuses the town and had no significant role is very good.
If you're not excited about Lachlan and a mafia being taken out of the game then I wonder if you actually have the town's interests at heart.
I'll put it down to you being inexperienced for now Lumi. Lachlan has lost the town games multiple times in the past as a town player just fyi. Be happy he's gone.
12/22/2016 10:44:00
You can't hit mafia every time, so if we do mis-lynch then picking a player that constantly confuses the town and had no significant role is very good.
If you're not excited about Lachlan and a mafia being taken out of the game then I wonder if you actually have the town's interests at heart.
I'll put it down to you being inexperienced for now Lumi. Lachlan has lost the town games multiple times in the past as a town player just fyi. Be happy he's gone.
12/22/2016 10:44:00
So that's cool. Right now I'm not really suss on anyone honestly but Extra pointing out Bijou as a potential band wagon starter is pretty interesting.
12/22/2016 11:25:39
12/22/2016 11:25:39
Hey guys, I'm back from work now.
I've never been in a game where only a mafia member has died night 1. Is this because mafia was blocked? If so, can we get information out of this without anyone coming forward? I'm so confused.
12/22/2016 11:42:43
I've never been in a game where only a mafia member has died night 1. Is this because mafia was blocked? If so, can we get information out of this without anyone coming forward? I'm so confused.
12/22/2016 11:42:43
Another possibility is that there is a Veteran/Paranoid Gun Owner. It is the shortest explanation of this situation as there doesn't need to be 2 or 3 different roles acting into the situation.
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Paranoid_Gun_Owner&redirect=no
Otherwise I can see all of the different situations JLo mentioned happening as if I remember correctly when Invisi and Aero were mafia they held the kill off to confuse the town. Or they could have seen the confusion that only have 1 night kill caused last game. The other explanation are pretty self explanatory.
12/22/2016 12:27:26
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Paranoid_Gun_Owner&redirect=no
Otherwise I can see all of the different situations JLo mentioned happening as if I remember correctly when Invisi and Aero were mafia they held the kill off to confuse the town. Or they could have seen the confusion that only have 1 night kill caused last game. The other explanation are pretty self explanatory.
12/22/2016 12:27:26
VOTE: whoever held up night phase for the full 48 hours
There are way too many possibilities for what happened this night phase:
- Protective role covered the mafia's target
- Mafioso was roleblocked or target was rolestopped
- Kill target was bulletproof
- Kill target commuted
- Kill target was swapped to MrL via redirecting role (e.g. Bus Driver)
- Mafia chose not to kill
- Serial Killer or similar third party killer killed MrL
- MrL targeted reflexive killing role e.g. gun owner (I'm sure there are plenty of guns in Pokémon)
- Vigilante killed MrL
- Bus Driver
Generally assuming leads to bad decisions (like "surely there isn't a one-shot neighbourizer in a game with a one-shot masonizer) so with the sheer amount of information we're in the dark about let's keep assumptions to a minimum.
... I generally respect most of the players in this game to be technically sound, so I feel even small slip-ups in logic should be looked into. MrL did this on page 16 with "Seeing as he's not jester and claiming bomb is dumb, it looks more likely he's arsonist?", and I feel Ghostbone may have done the same also page 16.
On the other hand I called out InsertName for being vague/posting summaries on Day 1 and above post keeps that trend so I'm still suss.
Had a look over the posts Extra mentioned. At the time I thought the sudden rush of activity on Lachlan in what was otherwise a slow-moving game was odd but bandwagons do happen in this game.
But let's have another look. Like I mentioned earlier faulty logic I will generally find scummy and those that jumped on because Lachlan was claiming arsonist I will group here, since yes even Lachlan wouldn't claim arsonist on Day 1. So that's Bijou cjeccjec Invisi Corvid? I'll have a look through these players another time, this post is getting long and it's pretty late right now.
Random thought: those players thinking Lachlan had a useful role at the start of Day 2 might be town, as I think a mafia team would tell each other that Vanilla Cop would probably be not helpful. Could be feigning ignorance I suppose...
Had a quick glance at MrL's posts. He pressured inactive players like Corvid. Mostly Corvid. Said mafia would be inclined to vote for a no lynch... iirc Luminescent Duon Invisi AutumnWind (or whatever his name is now) were all part of this group at some stage, maybe most of this group is town? If it was reflexive kill role they would also need to have been protected as well
12/22/2016 14:44:17
There are way too many possibilities for what happened this night phase:
- Protective role covered the mafia's target
- Mafioso was roleblocked or target was rolestopped
- Kill target was bulletproof
- Kill target commuted
- Kill target was swapped to MrL via redirecting role (e.g. Bus Driver)
- Mafia chose not to kill
- Serial Killer or similar third party killer killed MrL
- MrL targeted reflexive killing role e.g. gun owner (I'm sure there are plenty of guns in Pokémon)
- Vigilante killed MrL
- Bus Driver
Generally assuming leads to bad decisions (like "surely there isn't a one-shot neighbourizer in a game with a one-shot masonizer) so with the sheer amount of information we're in the dark about let's keep assumptions to a minimum.
... I generally respect most of the players in this game to be technically sound, so I feel even small slip-ups in logic should be looked into. MrL did this on page 16 with "Seeing as he's not jester and claiming bomb is dumb, it looks more likely he's arsonist?", and I feel Ghostbone may have done the same also page 16.
On the other hand I called out InsertName for being vague/posting summaries on Day 1 and above post keeps that trend so I'm still suss.
Had a look over the posts Extra mentioned. At the time I thought the sudden rush of activity on Lachlan in what was otherwise a slow-moving game was odd but bandwagons do happen in this game.
But let's have another look. Like I mentioned earlier faulty logic I will generally find scummy and those that jumped on because Lachlan was claiming arsonist I will group here, since yes even Lachlan wouldn't claim arsonist on Day 1. So that's Bijou cjeccjec Invisi Corvid? I'll have a look through these players another time, this post is getting long and it's pretty late right now.
Random thought: those players thinking Lachlan had a useful role at the start of Day 2 might be town, as I think a mafia team would tell each other that Vanilla Cop would probably be not helpful. Could be feigning ignorance I suppose...
Had a quick glance at MrL's posts. He pressured inactive players like Corvid. Mostly Corvid. Said mafia would be inclined to vote for a no lynch... iirc Luminescent Duon Invisi AutumnWind (or whatever his name is now) were all part of this group at some stage, maybe most of this group is town? If it was reflexive kill role they would also need to have been protected as well
12/22/2016 14:44:17
I'm all up to date with posts but I don't have all that much time to create a post myself and might not for the rest of the day. Just letting y'all know.
12/22/2016 22:24:33
12/22/2016 22:24:33
Extra said:As much as I was advocating for him in the pre-game, every game he just gives up as soon as the town bandwagons on him, which is no fun for anyone. Fortunately it doesn't sound like he used up a useful town role this game (I was worried when he died because I thought that he was an actual cop because I didn't look it up), so with Mr. L going down during the night, we're definitely ahead right now.
can we prohibit lachlan from playing in future games? his idea of "having fun" is playing completely anti-town and having people waste a lynch on him, which is incredibly frustrating for anyone trying to play the game properly (though if his role was indeed useless and identifies everyone as non-vanilla then he was honestly the optimal non-mafia lynch rofl).
Imo, the simplest explanation for the night occurences is 1) The serial killer killed Mr. L, and 2) The mafia either chose not to kill, or were blocked from doing so. Each of these points is important in its own right, and what's better is we can investigate them independently.
While it's possible that some shenanigans last night resulted in Mr. L being killed, the simplest explanation is that it was a serial killer (I rule out the possibility of a town-vig this early in the game for the same reasons as last game - mostly that there's no info to go off). We should look into who might've wanted Mr L dead, and why. The first place I suggest looking are the QLDers among us - early SK kills are often just for meme-like reasons because there's nothing of actual substance in the game yet to help choose targets. That said I haven't yet looked through the post history for clues, so something may also come up there.
Point 2 is a bit harder to work out, but it does mean that a couple of town members may have some info. For example, the doctor might be able to suspect that the person they targeted last night may have also been a mafia target, and so could quite possibly be town. Or if a watcher got a read of 2 players visiting someone, it probably means that one is mafia, one is a doctor, and the target is a townsperson. None of this is guaranteed of course, but it's much better than working with no info.
As for my joining the bandwagon, obviously in hindsight with how Lachlan reacted to it, it was a bad idea, but I stand by my intent to get him to explain his "fire" claim. I probably retracted my vote a bit too quickly - Extra and Dean are right in saying we should be more liberal with our votes. With that in mind...
Vote: Hydropimp
This guy's shifty and DK is lame.
12/22/2016 23:08:22
There wasn't any better lynch target day 1 than Lachlan in my opinion by the way based on how he was playing. You shouldn't be critical of the fact people were thinking he was arsonist. Regardless of whether or not anyone thought he would actually claim arsonist he was playing suspiciously enough to suspect that he had -some- sort of negative role.
What you -should- be being critical of is how quickly the lynch train started moving after I voted for him. We drew out the first day for a long time and, as I said in an earlier post, the longer we draw out the day phases the more likely the mafia are to slip up by inadvertently rushing a vote.
12/22/2016 23:15:28
What you -should- be being critical of is how quickly the lynch train started moving after I voted for him. We drew out the first day for a long time and, as I said in an earlier post, the longer we draw out the day phases the more likely the mafia are to slip up by inadvertently rushing a vote.
12/22/2016 23:15:28
I've looked through MrL's post on day 1 an the main thing that stands out to me is that he was insistent on smoking out Corvid. Aside from that, he was on the Lachlan bandwagon, idk if that information is helpful at all.
I've changed votes on Day 1 about 5 times or so I guess, and that was because no real pressure was being created aside from the Lachlan bandwagon. I would agree that town came out at a net positive in this engagement.
if you cant take the heat, why the fk would you go and play mafia ffs
12/23/2016 00:18:02
I've changed votes on Day 1 about 5 times or so I guess, and that was because no real pressure was being created aside from the Lachlan bandwagon. I would agree that town came out at a net positive in this engagement.
if you cant take the heat, why the fk would you go and play mafia ffs
12/23/2016 00:18:02
I would like to direct our attention to Corvid. Why would MrL be so insistent on lynching them? Did he just want a mislynch to happen?
I'm not voting for Corvid, I'm just asking them if they can tell us if they know as to why MrL was so insistent. I'll chuck a vote their way if they don't seem to respond.
I'm personally glad Lachlan got lynched. The Mafia would've just killed them night 1 after they made fire claims and so.
12/23/2016 00:29:17
I'm not voting for Corvid, I'm just asking them if they can tell us if they know as to why MrL was so insistent. I'll chuck a vote their way if they don't seem to respond.
I'm personally glad Lachlan got lynched. The Mafia would've just killed them night 1 after they made fire claims and so.
12/23/2016 00:29:17
how am i shifty please elaborate and DK isnt lame he is cool see 
12/23/2016 03:31:21
12/23/2016 03:31:21
HydroPimp said:
how am i shifty please elaborate and DK isnt lame he is cool see
thats funky kong
fraud
VOTE: hydropimp
12/23/2016 04:05:14
So at night Murkiri recruited me using his "1-shot masoner" power. It makes sense since we are good friends and he is new so he probably wants someone to help him out. We felt that it would be best to reveal because it confirms that we're town, we doubted that the mafia would make a play like this on day 2 and trusted that you'd believe us. Also if one of us dies or gets lynched then the other would be 100% confirmed town.
I am vanilla town.
12/23/2016 06:36:01
I am vanilla town.
12/23/2016 06:36:01
InsertName said:
So at night Murkiri recruited me using his "1-shot masoner" power. It makes sense since we are good friends and he is new so he probably wants someone to help him out. We felt that it would be best to reveal because it confirms that we're town, we doubted that the mafia would make a play like this on day 2 and trusted that you'd believe us. Also if one of us dies or gets lynched then the other would be 100% confirmed town.
I am vanilla town.
I can confirm this
12/23/2016 06:38:40
LachlanF should be banned from all future mafia games tbh.
Reading through everyone's posts atm. Corvid might be SK, and targeted MrL because MrL was being so aggressive towards him day one.
There's enough people that there's probably two killing factions, so I'm going to assume mafia got roleblocked or doctor saved their kill target (or they targeted the SK), and the SK killed MrL.
Is there any other reason the SK would have to target MrL?
Vote: Corvid
12/23/2016 06:56:49
Reading through everyone's posts atm. Corvid might be SK, and targeted MrL because MrL was being so aggressive towards him day one.
There's enough people that there's probably two killing factions, so I'm going to assume mafia got roleblocked or doctor saved their kill target (or they targeted the SK), and the SK killed MrL.
Is there any other reason the SK would have to target MrL?
Vote: Corvid
12/23/2016 06:56:49
InsertName said:
I am vanilla town.
I feel like you're not lying about masoniser forming with you, but I don't believe that you are just a vanilla townie. Unless other players can confirm otherwise, I'm very positive that every player in this game has a power role of some degree.
What happens if an SK / third party killer is masoned with as a matter of interest? Does the masoniser die?
12/23/2016 07:52:46
ok, i have a role but i don't want to say
12/23/2016 08:22:23
12/23/2016 08:22:23
A mason is only successful with town.
12/23/2016 08:22:46
12/23/2016 08:22:46